<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/strict.dtd">
<html>
<head>
</head>
<body style="background-color: #fff;">
<span style="display:none"> </span>
<!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlStartT|**|-~-->
<div id="ygrp-mlmsg" style="position:relative;">
<div id="ygrp-msg" style="z-index: 1;">
<!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlEndT|**|-~-->
<div id="ygrp-text" >
<p> <div style="width: 100%;font-size: initial;font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif;color: rgb(31, 73, 125);text-align: initial;background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">An excellent post, Rachel! </div><div style="width: 100%;font-size: initial;font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif;color: rgb(31, 73, 125);text-align: initial;background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">I, too, work only if the customer agrees to my hourly rate.</div><div style="width: 100%;font-size: initial;font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif;color: rgb(31, 73, 125);text-align: initial;background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><br></div> <div style="width: 100%;font-size: initial;font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif;color: rgb(31, 73, 125);text-align: initial;background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"><br></div> <div style="font-size: initial;font-family: Calibri, 'Slate Pro', sans-serif, sans-serif;color: rgb(31, 73, 125);text-align: initial;background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">Irina Knizhnik</div> <table width="100%" style="background-color:white;"> <tbody><tr><td colspan="2" style="font-size: initial;text-align: initial;background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"> <div style="border-style: solid none none;border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223);border-top-width: 1pt;padding: 3pt 0in 0in;font-family: Tahoma, 'BB Alpha Sans', 'Slate Pro';font-size: 10pt;"> <div><b>From: </b>'Rachel Douglas' ***@frontiernet.net [ruslantra]</div><div><b>Sent: </b>Saturday, October 10, 2015 4:38 PM</div><div><b>To: </b>***@yahoogroups.com</div><div><b>Reply To: </b>***@yahoogroups.com</div><div><b>Subject: </b>Re: [ru] Rastsenki za "vyverenie perevoda"?</div></div></td></tr></tbody></table><div style="border-style: solid none none;border-top-color: rgb(186, 188, 209);border-top-width: 1pt;font-size: initial;text-align: initial;background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"></div><br><div id="_originalContent">
<span> </span>
<div id="ygrp-text">
<p>
</p><div><font size="2" face="Arial">I think what I'll say is approximately the
same as Alla and Natalie, but here are my observations. I'm offered this kind of
work under the rubric of "having a native speaker of English check our
of-course-already-excellent Ru>En translation, done by a translator whose
native language is not English." </font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"></font> </div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial">1) Many customers attempt to call this
"proofreading." It is not proofreading. Proofreading is корректура: looking for
typos, missed paragraph indents, inconsistent capitalization, etc.</font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"></font> </div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial">2) Any other revisions of the text, beyond the
stage of editing the original for content, are called "copy-editing."
Sometimes it's useful to term the work "checking and copy-editing," especially
when it is acknowledged that there might be terminology or other problems
of meaning. The amount of time required for copy-editing of translations of
the type mentioned above varies enormously. I have copy-edited some translations
at speeds up to 1200 or 1400 words/hour, but those were the rare exception. In
the worst case, I managed 200 words/hour, which was slower than it would have
taken me to translate it myself from scratch. Usually I land somewhere in the
range between 400 and 1000.</font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"></font> </div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial">3) Therefore, I accept such jobs <u>only</u>
on the basis of an hourly rate. I explain the considerations in point 2 to the
customer. Often they reply, "Oh, of course ours can be done at 1000 words/hour
or faster." Therefore I always offer to copy-edit 1000 words of the given text
(and be paid for that), in order to gauge what speed is going to be possible.
And, I always offer them the opportunity to impose a ceiling: for example to
work on it for no more than 10 hours, and then give them a status
report so they can decide what to do with the rest of the job if it's not done
within that time.</font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"></font> </div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial">4) On the question of checking the translation
against the original, the extent to which this is necessary depends on the
quality of the translation. My experience is that it's almost always necessary
to some extent, even if the translation is very good. For example, yesterday I
was checking a Russian translation from English (i.e., the opposite direction
from what I'm mainly talking about). The original included a rhetorical,
idiomatic exclamation, "What do you mean?" It was only on the second go-through
that I noticed there was something strange about the translation: for the
original "Everybody says it's impossible to solve this problem. What do you
mean, impossible?", the draft translation of the second phrase was "Что значит,
невозможно?" - whereas it should probably be something like "Как это?"
(Obviously here I'm not doing the final edit, since the target language is
Russian; in this case, I'm merely looking it over, making suggestions, and
raising questions - all at my usual hourly rate.) It has also happened that the
customer said, "You can be confident that all the terminology has been
translated correctly, so you only need to check the grammar and syntax," but
then it turned out that there were terminology problems, as well.</font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"></font> </div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial">5) True, most of my customers who have agreed
to pay by the hour are based in the USA or Germany. With a few exceptions, most
customers in the Russian market are frightened of this
approach.</font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"></font> </div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial">Rachel</font></div>
<div><font size="2" face="Arial"></font> </div>
<p></p>
</div>
<!-- end group email -->
<br><!--end of _originalContent --></div>
</p>
</div>
<!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlStart|**|-~-->
<div style="color: #fff; height: 0;">__._,_.___</div>
<div style="clear:both"> </div>
<div id="fromDMARC" style="margin-top: 10px;">
<hr style="height:2px ; border-width:0; color:#E3E3E3; background-color:#E3E3E3;">
Posted by: Irina Knizhnik <***@gmail.com> <hr style="height:2px ; border-width:0; color:#E3E3E3; background-color:#E3E3E3;">
</div>
<div style="clear:both"> </div>
<table cellspacing=4px style="margin-top: 10px; margin-bottom: 10px; color: #2D50FD;">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; font-weight: bold; padding: 7px 5px 5px;" >
<a style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD" href="https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ruslantra/conversations/messages/200413;_ylc=X3oDMTJyc3Vha2MzBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzEwMzM2MjMEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA2NjY1MDkyBG1zZ0lkAzIwMDQxMwRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzE0NDQ1MjA2NTA-?act=reply&messageNum=200413">Reply via web post</a>
</td>
<td>•</td>
<td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5px 5px;" >
<a href="mailto:***@gmail.com?subject=Re%3A%20%5Bru%5D%20Rastsenki%20za%20%22vyverenie%20perevoda%22%3F" style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD;">
Reply to sender </a>
</td>
<td>•</td>
<td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5px 5px;">
<a href="mailto:***@yahoogroups.com?subject=Re%3A%20%5Bru%5D%20Rastsenki%20za%20%22vyverenie%20perevoda%22%3F" style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD">
Reply to group </a>
</td>
<td>•</td>
<td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5px 5px;" >
<a href="https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ruslantra/conversations/newtopic;_ylc=X3oDMTJlODE2NGNyBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzEwMzM2MjMEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA2NjY1MDkyBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA250cGMEc3RpbWUDMTQ0NDUyMDY1MA--" style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD">Start a New Topic</a>
</td>
<td>•</td>
<td style="font-size: 12px; font-family: arial; padding: 7px 5px 5px;color: #2D50FD;" >
<a href="https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ruslantra/conversations/topics/200398;_ylc=X3oDMTM4NjdxYW03BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzEwMzM2MjMEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA2NjY1MDkyBG1zZ0lkAzIwMDQxMwRzZWMDZnRyBHNsawN2dHBjBHN0aW1lAzE0NDQ1MjA2NTAEdHBjSWQDMjAwMzk4" style="text-decoration: none; color: #2D50FD;">Messages in this topic</a>
(10)
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<!------- Start Nav Bar ------>
<!-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| -->
<!-- |**|end egp html banner|**| -->
<!-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| -->
<div id="ygrp-vital" style="background-color: #f2f2f2; font-family: Verdana; font-size: 10px; margin-bottom: 10px; padding: 10px;">
<span id="vithd" style="font-weight: bold; color: #333; text-transform: uppercase; "><a href="https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/ruslantra/info;_ylc=X3oDMTJlMm0zdm5lBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAzEwMzM2MjMEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA2NjY1MDkyBHNlYwN2dGwEc2xrA3ZnaHAEc3RpbWUDMTQ0NDUyMDY1MA--" style="text-decoration: none;">Visit Your Group</a></span>
<ul style="list-style-type: none; margin: 0; padding: 0; display: inline;">
</ul>
</div>
<div id="ft" style="font-family: Arial; font-size: 11px; margin-top: 5px; padding: 0 2px 0 0; clear: both;">
<a href="https://groups.yahoo.com/neo;_ylc=X3oDMTJkNjlhcDlmBF9TAzk3NDc2NTkwBGdycElkAzEwMzM2MjMEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA2NjY1MDkyBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2dmcARzdGltZQMxNDQ0NTIwNjUw" style="float: left;"><img src="
Loading Image...
" height="15" width="137" alt="Yahoo! Groups" style="border: 0;"/></a>
<div style="color: #747575; float: right;"> • <a href="https://info.yahoo.com/privacy/us/yahoo/groups/details.html" style="text-decoration: none;">Privacy</a> • <a href="mailto:ruslantra-***@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe" style="text-decoration: none;">Unsubscribe</a> • <a href="https://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/terms/" style="text-decoration: none;">Terms of Use</a> </div>
</div>
<br>
<!-- |**|end egp html banner|**| -->
</div> <!-- ygrp-msg -->
<!-- Sponsor -->
<!-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| -->
<div id="ygrp-sponsor" style="width:160px; float:right; clear:none; margin:0 0 25px 0; background: #fff;">
<!-- Start Recommendations -->
<div id="ygrp-reco">
</div>
<!-- End Recommendations -->
</div> <!-- |**|end egp html banner|**| -->
<div style="clear:both; color: #FFF; font-size:1px;">.</div>
</div>
<img src="http://geo.yahoo.com/serv?s=97359714/grpId=1033623/grpspId=1706665092/msgId=200413/stime=1444520650" width="1" height="1"> <br>
<img src="http://y.analytics.yahoo.com/fpc.pl?ywarid=515FB27823A7407E&a=10001310322279&js=no&resp=img" width="1" height="1">
<div style="color: #fff; height: 0;">__,_._,___</div>
<!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlEnd|**|-~-->
</body>
<!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlStart|**|-~-->
<head>
<style type="text/css">
<!--
#ygrp-mkp {
border: 1px solid #d8d8d8;
font-family: Arial;
margin: 10px 0;
padding: 0 10px;
}
#ygrp-mkp hr {
border: 1px solid #d8d8d8;
}
#ygrp-mkp #hd {
color: #628c2a;
font-size: 85%;
font-weight: 700;
line-height: 122%;
margin: 10px 0;
}
#ygrp-mkp #ads {
margin-bottom: 10px;
}
#ygrp-mkp .ad {
padding: 0 0;
}
#ygrp-mkp .ad p {
margin: 0;
}
#ygrp-mkp .ad a {
color: #0000ff;
text-decoration: none;
}
#ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc {
font-family: Arial;
}
#ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc #hd {
margin: 10px 0px;
font-weight: 700;
font-size: 78%;
line-height: 122%;
}
#ygrp-sponsor #ygrp-lc .ad {
margin-bottom: 10px;
padding: 0 0;
}
#actions {
font-family: Verdana;
font-size: 11px;
padding: 10px 0;
}
#activity {
background-color: #e0ecee;
float: left;
font-family: Verdana;
font-size: 10px;
padding: 10px;
}
#activity span {
font-weight: 700;
}
#activity span:first-child {
text-transform: uppercase;
}
#activity span a {
color: #5085b6;
text-decoration: none;
}
#activity span span {
color: #ff7900;
}
#activity span .underline {
text-decoration: underline;
}
.attach {
clear: both;
display: table;
font-family: Arial;
font-size: 12px;
padding: 10px 0;
width: 400px;
}
.attach div a {
text-decoration: none;
}
.attach img {
border: none;
padding-right: 5px;
}
.attach label {
display: block;
margin-bottom: 5px;
}
.attach label a {
text-decoration: none;
}
blockquote {
margin: 0 0 0 4px;
}
.bold {
font-family: Arial;
font-size: 13px;
font-weight: 700;
}
.bold a {
text-decoration: none;
}
dd.last p a {
font-family: Verdana;
font-weight: 700;
}
dd.last p span {
margin-right: 10px;
font-family: Verdana;
font-weight: 700;
}
dd.last p span.yshortcuts {
margin-right: 0;
}
div.attach-table div div a {
text-decoration: none;
}
div.attach-table {
width: 400px;
}
div.file-title a, div.file-title a:active, div.file-title a:hover, div.file-title a:visited {
text-decoration: none;
}
div.photo-title a, div.photo-title a:active, div.photo-title a:hover, div.photo-title a:visited {
text-decoration: none;
}
div#ygrp-mlmsg #ygrp-msg p a span.yshortcuts {
font-family: Verdana;
font-size: 10px;
font-weight: normal;
}
.green {
color: #628c2a;
}
.MsoNormal {
margin: 0 0 0 0;
}
o {
font-size: 0;
}
#photos div {
float: left;
width: 72px;
}
#photos div div {
border: 1px solid #666666;
height: 62px;
overflow: hidden;
width: 62px;
}
#photos div label {
color: #666666;
font-size: 10px;
overflow: hidden;
text-align: center;
white-space: nowrap;
width: 64px;
}
#reco-category {
font-size: 77%;
}
#reco-desc {
font-size: 77%;
}
.replbq {
margin: 4px;
}
#ygrp-actbar div a:first-child {
/* border-right: 0px solid #000;*/
margin-right: 2px;
padding-right: 5px;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg {
font-size: 13px;
font-family: Arial, helvetica,clean, sans-serif;
*font-size: small;
*font: x-small;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg table {
font-size: inherit;
font: 100%;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg select, input, textarea {
font: 99% Arial, Helvetica, clean, sans-serif;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg pre, code {
font:115% monospace;
*font-size:100%;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg * {
line-height: 1.22em;
}
#ygrp-mlmsg #logo {
padding-bottom: 10px;
}
#ygrp-msg p a {
font-family: Verdana;
}
#ygrp-msg p#attach-count span {
color: #1E66AE;
font-weight: 700;
}
#ygrp-reco #reco-head {
color: #ff7900;
font-weight: 700;
}
#ygrp-reco {
margin-bottom: 20px;
padding: 0px;
}
#ygrp-sponsor #ov li a {
font-size: 130%;
text-decoration: none;
}
#ygrp-sponsor #ov li {
font-size: 77%;
list-style-type: square;
padding: 6px 0;
}
#ygrp-sponsor #ov ul {
margin: 0;
padding: 0 0 0 8px;
}
#ygrp-text {
font-family: Georgia;
}
#ygrp-text p {
margin: 0 0 1em 0;
}
#ygrp-text tt {
font-size: 120%;
}
#ygrp-vital ul li:last-child {
border-right: none !important;
}
-->
</style>
</head>
<!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlEnd|**|-~-->
</html>
<!-- end group email -->
